I’m thinking of buying a good amount of rice and dried beans. What other non perishable should I keep at hand?
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Not quite what you’re asking, but this was a comment I copied on long term food storage for just such an occasion. Don’t remember the original author, I’m afraid.
If you have the space + money:
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Flour is much cheaper in bulk. 25 lbs is ~30-50% cheaper bought all at once rather then 5 lbs at a time.
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Storage is very important. I recommend a 5 gallon food grade bucket with a gamma lid. https://www.amazon.com/Gamma2-Seal-Lid-Combo-3pk/dp/B0CZW3QB79
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Pest control is important with bulk food storage. Things that help include putting bay leaves in the flour, using an oxygen-killing pack in with the flour before sealing it for the first time, and using a secondary container for ~3-5 libs at a time so that the storage container is opened infrequently.
For non-flour items, I recommend using the same strategy but for rice and beans. Rice can be kept free of pets by baking it at 150 for 30 minutes before storage. You can do the same for beans though the quality degrades a tiny bit (beans have fewer pests anyways).
1 bucket of each is enough food for 2 people for a couple months all by itself (plus a vitamin to avoid malnutrition). Not a bad way to buffer yourself from food price swings. If you get some bulk fat like a gallon of refined coconut oil or peanut butter, you’ll have a ton more calories for cheap. I’d say the total cost for everything I just described is around $150-250 and would be enough calories for 2 people for 3ish months. Add some bulk spices and canned tomatoes and it could even taste good.
Also all of these tips work for mutual aid buys and storage if you have access to a kitchen.
Rice can be kept free of pets by baking it at 150
We might have cute weevilposting here but I don’t relish the time I had to deal with them. LFMF, the regular deli meat tubs are not insect-proof containers.
I had some weevils once, they got in on some rice. They were so cute but also got into so many things! I put everything in glass or hard plastic now.
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Rice and beans are pretty much the things
rice and beans keep as dry for a long time and there a lot of diversity in beans. black beans, red kidney beans, the world of peeled/unpeeled lentils. so many beans. dried beans are so cheap, but preparing them takes a lot of time without a pressure cooker, like an instant pot (strong recommend!)
if you want to take things a step further, unground wheat, rye (aka “berries”) are also insanely shelf stable and can be soaked to become edible… but really you would want a stone mill to enjoy, which grinds all kinds of stuff at room temp (heat from other griders accelerates breakdown and you lose nutritional value quicker).
if you get a stone mill (i love my mockmill 100, it wasn’t cheap. its the cadillac of home scale mills) you can grind all kinds of shit, including your beans and rice to make all kinds of flours to side step sensitivities or just try wack shit. and you unlock a whole world of dry goods that can be bought in bulk in their most shelf stable configuration.
with a stone mill, you can start getting really weird in the kitchen. being calorie resilient in the face of supply chain shocks is about linking up with some local grain/pulse grower to buy a super cheap sack of whatever in bulk instead of scouring your grocery store for whatever bullshit they have at retail markup. you would probably be able to double or triple whatever they get at the grain elevator and not even bat an eye. they won’t give a fuck, especially if you have your own container like a 22 qt food grade Cambro. you’re basically handing them $20 for an unnoticed amount of their giant grain pile (40 lbs?).
the cwt (hundred pounds) prices of commodity grains and pulses make a years’ supply a rounding error. like cents per pound, so its like free $ to them.
so, im talking about significant investments in gadgetry for home processing of bulk grains, but the cost savings are incredible. and it really is a whole other level of quality when you’re cooking/baking with freshly ground grains. you weigh the berries out to be what you want for each recipe and only grind as much as you need, so the waste is negligible.
anyway, im still regarded as eccentric even among food cranks for getting into this years ago, but i can make sick bread/doughs and gfree cookies that will fuck u up. and all i think about is how cheap and extensive my dry good collection is. lots of beans, rice, spelt, wheat, rye. i can throw down like a bronze age baker.
peeled/unpeeled lentils
Imagine being me when your Indian boss keeps talking at you about how the lentil in your lentils isn’t the right lentil. because it isn’t split. I don’t buy the food!
split, that’s the right term. i forgot.
when i was getting into this is when i learned red lentils are brown lentils that have been split (dal). i think.
i used to live near an indian grocery. and not like a tiny one little place, but a serious one the size of like a real suburban grocery store. there was an aisle of just different types of lentils, in more colors than i could count. their spice aisle was unreal too.
that was when i learned that I don’t know what i am doing and people from real cultures have forgotten more than ill ever know about the basics of food.
This is the most exciting comment I’ve read in a long time. I think I love you a bit.
Just one question: I’ve heard of stone mills grinding stone into your flour and grinding down your teeth eventually. Is this a thing or a myth?
i think that’s a myth, though i admit i hadn’t heard of it. i mean, once something is as small as flour, we’re not really chewing it anymore. it’s more like clay, particle size wise, since i’m not perceiving any grit like sand or even silt size. at that size, it’s smooth and we just swallow and either convert it into energy through chemical/biological processes or pass it.
the “stone milling as superior” is something i picked up from a friend of mine i went to school with. we both did undergrad in ecological food/nutrition systems at a bigass agriculture college at the same time. i did my MSc in soil carbon and water use while he did his on wheat genetics and bread making, but he had already gone to culinary school and worked as a chef for years. we were both the old guys in class. he had this whole spiel (which started with “aw, dude”) about stone grinding breaking open the berry, but keeping it cool / slowing the breakdown of this crazy list of micronutrients and enzymatic processes so you get the best stuff in the baking process, before ambient microbes can get it. like store bought flour is basically devoid of all this other stuff so it can stay on the shelf and not go rancid. so it’s not a big deal if you use a processor like a vitamix that generates heat from friction, because you’re still getting all the stuff that store bought won’t give you, but why not just do it perfect to get the maximum value if you’re going to get into this shit? also, stone grinding is pretty quiet compared to a blender/processor.
if you’re really wanting to go low budget and bronze age tech, you can buy handcrank mills, but i understand they are a coarser grind, can require multiple passes, and are no joke about muscle power. my mockmill is fucking ludicrous. i can adjust the fineness of the grind to a degree i can barely perceive to the touch, and do enough for a big loaf of bread or cookies in like… 45 seconds? accurate baking goes by weight instead of volume, so i already had a little scale. i put a little bowl on there, tare it to 0, and then add my 200g of berries. grind it, and i have 200g of flour. so, making something with “fresh ground grains” adds maybe an entire minute to a prep/baking process, but when you tell people you “ground the grains just before baking” they look at you like you’ve done something inconceivably bespoke and artisanal.
I can’t stop thinking of mills and grain, hope you’re happy lmao.
Could you detail a bit more about the process of finding farmers who sell you the dry berries (chickpea, bean, wheat, rye, buckwheat…)?
that is tricky, but a great question. many countries, even highly developed ones, don’t necessarily have some kind of “farm registration” list, especially not a public one. even USDA farm census data leaves a lot to be desired. a larger scale grain grower… is almost certainly not going to have a website, though it’s possible. that would be an outlier, basically some grain grower who is already engaged in this kind of activity. they don’t necessarily want a bunch of people coming out to their property whenever to buy shit, so the tendency for “local grain” producers is to connect with those grocery co-ops where they can sell more at once and reduce on farm traffic. and while those co-ops mark up the prices, it’s still usually way cheaper to get those whole berries from them than to buy already milled flour. plus, already milled isn’t shelf stable.
if you’re deadset on finding some grain grower to buy direct from (rather than going through a co-op) as a periodic one off transaction, you’ll want to look up your state (or whatever the typical administrative unit is) for a “wheat grower” (or bean grower, or rye grower) “association”. they don’t typically have a public membership list (but it happens), and that would be one way to try and find nearby producers. then it’s a matter of befriending them and trying to figure something out, assuming they’re not set up for retail already.
the thing with dry grains is, at least in the US, the commodity system and market concentration of processors generally pushes people into regional specialization. for instance, the midwestern US… everybody is growing corn and soybeans. at the northern edge of that you will find more wheat, at the southern edge you will find softer winter wheats, and in the inland pacific northwest you will find more lentil production. so you probably have to look at some national and regional statistics to find out what the dominant grains are going to be in your area. it will be easy to find that type of grower there. where it starts to get tricky are people growing things outside of that specialization area. it absolutely happens, but they are far more difficult to find. it is rare to find someone growing a wide variety of grains/pulses at larger scale, because the mechanization infrastructure is very specialized for each species.
but, in short, i would start by finding those crunchy grocery co-ops. they tend to have a pretty serious selection of bulk dry grains/pulses. depending on how transparent they are (to members vs not), you might be able to figure out where all those are sourced from. some could be local but some are gonna be shipped through a national buying organization like UNFI. the next step would be to search for “[insert grain/pulse here] growers association [your state/region]” and see what you can find. like maybe there’s a conference coming up with a trade show where you could meet people. additionally, depending on how big the association is, you could email some of the honchos and inquire about any members interested in or currently selling retail.
a hail mary, if there’s no robust or responsive organization (common!), would be to just search "bulk purchase [grain/pulse] [your state/region] and see what’s going on with the people trying to find that local market channel.
i’ve found a few weirdo bean growers in my area that sell retail that way, but they are pretty small scale and definitely trying to focus on those sales, so their prices are higher than commodity. though they do have a totally weird assortment. bean diversity is a whole thing here. north america was a site of bean domestication and it lends itself to seed saving easily, so there’s more bean varieties than gods once you start looking outside the standard set (kidney, navy, black, black-eyed, etc), and their taxa is super ad-hoc/cultural. “greasy half-runners” etc.
if you just want to start experimenting with wheat/rye berries, the US has national sellers where you can order sampler packs (a collection of 1.5-3 pound bags) of a bunch of different wheats/ryes to screw around with them to see how baking is different. janie’s mill is p cool for that, but the price point is significantly higher than if you find a local source. unless you want to go full doomsday and register as a wholesale buyer to get a whole pallet of something dropshipped to the end of your driveway.
oh, i thought of one other strategy for finding nearish grains/pulse growers. basically, look for your nearest “feed mill” , which might be listed as a “feed and seed” operation. ideally it would not be a national chain like Tractor Supply, and more like some total mom-and-pop or with a vague association for independents like Southern States or Ace. basically, the place where nearby growers buy feed grains and hay in bulk, and other random assorted shit like fencing supplies, muck boots, and agrichemicals. they are going to be cagey, probably, about selling you whole grains if they get the idea you’re buying for your own (human) consumption, but maybe you can at least figure out what they have to offer (milo, corn, etc). they are typically a big grain storage place so if you see stuff like these white things:
you’re in the right place. there are much bigger ones than that, but if you’re seeing the giant ones, you’re likely not looking at a retail operation.
anyway, a smaller feed and seed usually has their own smallish industrial mill. their bread and butter is purchasing and milling whole grains and mixing them for sale to farmers with livestock. like they’ll have their various rations “hog grower”, “laying hen”, “broiler”, “dairy total mixed ration” as final products they are looking to sell, so they would be trying to steer you towards these mixes of milled grains instead of whole berries. but if you can play it cool and act like you’re a small hog farmer trying to pencil out a loan to scale up or experimenting with developing a “finishing” ration, you might be able to get them to tell you where some of their feed stock is coming from and how sensitive it is to transport cost increases. like maybe not the name of the guy they buy from, but maybe the area. and likely, it’s all coming from way the hell elsewhere, purchased through some grain elevator, but you never know. the feed and seed option is a total longshot, but those places are super interesting to check out anyway.
and, one last final left field idea, if you want to find pretty reasonable bulk prices for things like dried beans, you might looking for restaurant supply places. that’s if you don’t care about local and are legit just trying to stockpile like a prepper. shipping can be brutal unless you have access to a place with a loading dock where you can receive deliveries. they do not like to ship to residential.
there are national restaurant supply places and regional. Sysco, US Foods, PFG. the local alternative to them would be to find a Food Hub, which is a nebulous, struggling conceptual enterprise/non profit usually organized around some kind of maintaining regional control over food distribution infrastructure. a Food Hub might not be in your area, or there could be multiple. it might not have anything you’re looking for (they do tend to be organized around fresh produce rather than dry goods), but they do tend to be weird and aligned with this concept of relinking production and consumption in communities so they could be a resource if they have time to answer questions.
Amazing wealth of info, thank you SO much. Seeing as I’m in Spain, I think my first step would be to try and find a grain coop (we have lots of coops in Spain with agriculture in smaller municipalities). Thankfully distances here are smaller than in the US, and there are some well-known varieties of legumes (judiones de San Ildefonso, lenteja de Armuña…) that are grown in specific places not terribly far from me. If I could find a coop dealing in the tens of kilos, that would be great.
As for restaurant-type shipping I don’t expect it to be an issue, most deliveries here are with vans and restaurants absolutely don’t have loading docks, so I may also find some luck there, good idea, or even possibly visiting Mercamadrid! (A mayorist-oriented market in Madrid where most fruit shops stock themselves).
Thanks so much for the inspiration!! Last question if it’s not too much, a 300€ mill like the one you told me is pretty much out of the question for me for starters. I’ve seen some likely shitty mills for 20€ish, hand-crank, the type you screw to a table and use like that:
My question is: is this useless trash that I’ll throw to the garbage as soon as I attempt to use it? Or is there any actual usability to these? I’m not a picky eater so if it grinds usable flour (even if not the thinnest and finest) it would be fine for me
i legit have not used one, but i would want to confirm the size of the hopper which will be crucial for larger grains. like i would want one that holds at least 0.5 liters or more, just because it would be annoying to have to reload it frequently if you’re doing a big grind of a bigger grain. you are probably going to want to leave it clamped to wherever you install it and clamp the shit out of it, so i wouldn’t attach it to a “nice” countertop. probably something that is wood, like a work surface, that you don’t mind putting a little clamp-sized bite into.
since i don’t know that much about them, i reached out to my friend to see if there are any styles/models he recommends to consider/avoid. just searching around, there are so many options. my impulse would be to try and find one oriented towards commercial bakers, because it’s probably going to be made to be servicable with a long use life. that could be overkill, but i share your distrust of cheap kitchen gadgets.
anyway, i will let you know what he says when he gets back to me.
You’re an OG, thanks so much. I’ve found some livestock feed stores within an hour by car from my location selling 20kg bags of grain (wheat, rye, corn, millet) for some 10€ each, which is bonkers cheap per calorie. I might just have to get into this stuff!!
I’ve heard that as well from an archeologist but I’m kinda doubtful that it would make a significant difference compared to teeth grinding on each other as you chew.
Maybe if it’s a mill stone that chips a lot or sandstone.
I’d guess something like this is going to produce a lot more stone dust compared to some precision shaped granite.
Rice, lots and lots of rice. Corn flour is also pretty great for tortillas
Cubans basically lived off rice and beans during the special period.
Flour for bread. If you haven’t made bread from scratch it is much easier to make than most fussy youtube videos, with all the professional accoutrement, make it seem.
Canned foods last for years. Tomatos, green beans, corn or other veggies are good to have.
Some other source of fat for eating or cooking in. Peanut butter, coconut oil, etc. Olive oil, although the good stuff gets nasty after a year or so.
Yes buy me. I’m all yours.
Your local warehouse store might have a policy where you don’t have to have a membership if you pay cash. Get yourself some bulk basics like you and others have mentioned. Also, know where your local food banks are.
Other things to consider stocking
- bullion (soup stock base) dried cubes or wet.
- powdered milk
- coffee (doubles as currency in very tough times)
- sugar
- Salt (have some iodized salt on hand)
- Yeast
- Chicken, tofu, or your other fave proteins that come in vacuum packed bulk portions. Cut them apart and flatten them so they’ll stack neatly and throw them in the freezer.
- When you see meats on sale and you can do so, buy and freeze them. The cheaper cuts take more time to cook and sometimes prep. Get familiar with how to remove bones etc, and how to use them to create more stock or fats for cooking. I usually buy skin on chicken, remove the skin and render the fat down to use for cooking various things. It keeps indefinitely in the fridge. Bacon fat can also be saved to add flavors to your cooking too.
Go to your local SE Asian type grocer and stock up on staple spices - you will save a shit ton. My local white people supermarket will sell be a jar of cumin for $10 while the Indian grocer further away will sell me a 2 pound bag for $6.50.
Neutral oil. Very calorie-dense, you need it for lots of culinary purposes, and if you use it judiciously it can last a good while.
Salt probably won’t get expensive but it’s an important thing to have plenty of.
As has been said, storage and processing are going to be more of a financial hurdle than the food itself. I like to buy big glass jars (quart-size or bigger) to put stuff in.
If you haven’t already, buy seeds of things you want to grow. Find a balcony or south-facing porch to put pots or buckets on, or locate a nearby abandoned lot to grow things on. Veggies will have much more substantial price shocks.
I recommend making strong local connections with mutual aid groups and food pantries. They will be doing exactly these sorts of things at scale. You can even give them money to help you do it and you will come out on top.
But for personal individual recommendations:
- Dry stable pantry good that you store securely. Beans, rice.
- Securely means against pests, so a hard container with no entry point when closed that seals well enough so that hey don’t spoil for a few years. Dry goods last a very long time but can go rancid if you don’t store them properly. Food grade buckets, mylar in metal trash containers, etc. If your system seals, then you can put in packets that eat up the oxygen, preventing pests and food going rancid, but that is for long-term storage, since once you open it up then you have oxygen again.
- Flour goes rancid faster than rice and beans, you have to store it properly.
- A decent multivitamin and common deficiency vitamins (D, B12, iron). You can store these the same way so if you have a huge amount you can put them in a sealed container with an oxygen-eating packet.
- Spices and salt. Spices can be stored the same way as everything else and are very, very I expensive in bulk.
- High-calorie shelf-stable fats like peanut butter, coconut oil, and cooking oil. You can buy restaurant-size 4-gallon jugs of it (in cardboard boxes) for maybe $30-60.
One of those oil containers, 50 pounds of beans and rice, and vitamins and salt will last a single person over 100 days if that is the only thing they eat. The limiting ingredient is actually the beans and rice so you can get even double that and still not run out of the oil.
Realistically you would probably just use these ingredients for half of your meals, maybe, and still eat diverse foods in general. These foods are so inexpensive in bulk that your average food cost goes way down and you can eat more of it to decrease food costs during any crises.
Rice should be stored as cool as possible if you’re keeping it long term. All rice has insect eggs in it, which will hatch if you leave it long enough. The rice is still generally usable, but it’s better to keep it in a cool shed or something if you can. You can also bake it at a pretty low temperature for 45 minutes before you store it, if you have the ability to do that.
Oh yes I forgot to add rice notes. This is all true. Brown rice goes rancid fast and has the other issues you mention. Long term storage should be cooll, dark, and ideally in an container from which oxygen has been removed.
Also you can cook rice at a low temperature in the oven to prevent insect issues. The downside of this is that you have to use the rice sooner as this process destabilizes some of the aromatics. You can also freeze + thaw the rice but you have to be careful to not allow moisture to remain in it.
Haven’t seen anyone say anything about if you have space to grow anything there are certain things like say green onions that you can poke the white ends into soil and if you get a dozen + growing you pretty much have those on hand. Herbs you find yourself using a lot of are great too, basil is generally super easy to grow once you get it going but it’s so expensive at the store I can’t be bothered with it.
Dried pasta, canned tomatoes
Canned goods.
If you eat meat, canned chicken lasts a very long time
