In 1948, the United Nations Genocide Convention defined genocide as any of five “acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group.” These five acts were: killing members of the group, causing them serious bodily or mental harm, imposing living conditions intended to destroy the group, preventing births, and forcibly transferring children out of the group.
So, while there may be debate on whether the Holdomor technically meets the definition of a genocide, it still constitutes mass murder.
That is not necessarily true because it is not easy to establish intent. As far as I know there is not a clear idea on even the numbers, only estimates that have been quite far apart. I do not think there is adequate grounds to conclude that it was done with intent, nor to rule it out, hence why it is under debate.
Would you consider the frequent man-made famines in ireland in the 19th century, including the very famous great famine, an example of ‘genocide’ or mass murder?
Soviets took away all food from Ukrainian villages. They searched for hidden compartments, they probed the ground, so it wasn’t possible to hide food. They didn’t allow picking leftover grains from fields. What is the probability that the famine was unintentional? I doubt it was a big surprise that people without food starve and die.
Canada recognizes its multiple genocides against the First Nations. We have days dedicated to indigenous Canadians and activly trying to put indigenous voices first.
The same can’t be said about China, Russia or the US.
Taken from Wikipedia:
So, while there may be debate on whether the Holdomor technically meets the definition of a genocide, it still constitutes mass murder.
That is not necessarily true because it is not easy to establish intent. As far as I know there is not a clear idea on even the numbers, only estimates that have been quite far apart. I do not think there is adequate grounds to conclude that it was done with intent, nor to rule it out, hence why it is under debate.
Yeah, but man made famines still aren’t okay, even if you don’t intent to destroy a people.
Would you consider the frequent man-made famines in ireland in the 19th century, including the very famous great famine, an example of ‘genocide’ or mass murder?
Yes, that is a genocide.
Yes? Especially for the genocide part.
Of course not and I think the most valuable we can learn from history is how to prevent something of the kind from happening again.
That’s why we should steer away from authoritarianism, which is what these communities want.
Soviets took away all food from Ukrainian villages. They searched for hidden compartments, they probed the ground, so it wasn’t possible to hide food. They didn’t allow picking leftover grains from fields. What is the probability that the famine was unintentional? I doubt it was a big surprise that people without food starve and die.
What about Canadian genocide of the indigenous? Surely you count that?
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It is, but so are some others that people seem to miss.
Canada recognizes its multiple genocides against the First Nations. We have days dedicated to indigenous Canadians and activly trying to put indigenous voices first.
The same can’t be said about China, Russia or the US.