Aren’t Christians the biggest idolaters? They always pray at statues of Mary and other saints. If I remember correctly Mary and all the saints aren’t deities.
You have Catholics and Protestants, and under Protestants you have a shit ton of denominations (Baptist, Methodist, Prebyterian, Pentecostal, etc).
Under each of those protestant denominations you can then have different conventions.
Catholics tend to be a lot more ‘ritualistic’ than say Baptists. They’re also the only ones with any respect for the pope. Protestants see that as idolism, and the pope having 0 importance.
Catholics are the ones known for intercessory prayer, wherein you pray to someone “God-adjacent,” and ask them to talk to God on your behalf. Mary is a big one for sure, Joseph is sometimes in there, whatever relevant patron saint, etc. It’s so engrained that there are little nursery rhyme style “chants” for things sometimes:
Tony, Tony, look around, something is lost and must be found.
That’s Catholics specifically, and if you think it’s hypocritical to pray to graven idols then man your mind is gonna blow when you hear what they do to children…
Oh, good old whataboutism. All I did was point out that next to rampant and systemic child molestation in the Catholic Church, worshipping the wrong-shaped chunk of whatever seems like small potatoes.
not really whataboutism. more like it sounded to me like you where saying it was only catholics and its rampant in all sorts of clergy and youth ministers and such. along with burying and such to.
Aren’t Christians the biggest idolaters? They always pray at statues of Mary and other saints. If I remember correctly Mary and all the saints aren’t deities.
I was correcting the guy that it’s Catholics specifically who worship graven idols, not that it’s only Catholic clergy doing the molesting.
sorry. I did see who you responded to but it literally sounded like someone christian who was adding on about catholics so had to put in my sarcastic two cents.
Sure, the art can be beautiful, but I’m not sure of the relevance here? Doesn’t change that people pray to them all the time, in direct contravention of one of the Commandments of their religion, not does it unmolest a single child.
My personal take is that Jesus was a cool dude with some good ideas, but the majority of people who claim to follow his teachings don’t, and that’s why we are where we’re at.
The relevance is that conflating idolatry with the majority of Western art over the last two millennia is a little hyperbolic.
There is a lot of beautiful Catholic art. I understand the Muslim argument against portraying the human form, and they have some beautiful art and architecture.
The statues or paintings (or reproductions) aren’t necessary to the prayers any more than the rosary beads are. I doubt you’ll find many Catholics who would claim the objects held much importance other than being something to look at or hold. The same goes for the candles, incense, and vestments. They’re fun props, but most people understand they’re only that.
Some people don’t like them, and that’s okay too. I don’t understand the appeal of Southern Baptist services or church buildings.
My reading of the text forbids praying to gods other than the One True God or to graven idols, rules which the practices of Catholicism break on the regular. That’s my opinion, based on the text as written, and it’s not changing unless the text does.
As to the practice itself, I couldn’t give a shit beyond the fact that it makes Catholics who pray to saints hypocrites. If you want to defend it, defend it to your god, but I’m pretty sure he’d prefer the rampant child abuse to be taken care of first.
Aren’t Christians the biggest idolaters? They always pray at statues of Mary and other saints. If I remember correctly Mary and all the saints aren’t deities.
TBF that’s not all Christians. They did have wars and murder a lot of people because they disagreed on that kind of stuff.
Everyone’s a heretic to somebody!
Or sometimes because the local land owning gentry realized he could take some monestary’s land if he thought Martin Luther was onto something.
A lot of them have an obsession with the American flag that I would argue is idolatry at that point.
And guns don’t forget the gun worship.
Actually a lot of Christians hate on Catholics specifically because of their praise of Mary and the other saints.
Yeah those Christians don’t ignore the parts of the bible that we ignore. Those heretics.
That’s Catholics.
You have Catholics and Protestants, and under Protestants you have a shit ton of denominations (Baptist, Methodist, Prebyterian, Pentecostal, etc).
Under each of those protestant denominations you can then have different conventions.
Catholics tend to be a lot more ‘ritualistic’ than say Baptists. They’re also the only ones with any respect for the pope. Protestants see that as idolism, and the pope having 0 importance.
Catholics are the ones known for intercessory prayer, wherein you pray to someone “God-adjacent,” and ask them to talk to God on your behalf. Mary is a big one for sure, Joseph is sometimes in there, whatever relevant patron saint, etc. It’s so engrained that there are little nursery rhyme style “chants” for things sometimes:
St. Anthony is the “patron saint of lost items.”
That’s Catholics specifically, and if you think it’s hypocritical to pray to graven idols then man your mind is gonna blow when you hear what they do to children…
thank satan no protestant or non denominationals are like that.
Oh, good old whataboutism. All I did was point out that next to rampant and systemic child molestation in the Catholic Church, worshipping the wrong-shaped chunk of whatever seems like small potatoes.
not really whataboutism. more like it sounded to me like you where saying it was only catholics and its rampant in all sorts of clergy and youth ministers and such. along with burying and such to.
I was responding to a post that read
I was correcting the guy that it’s Catholics specifically who worship graven idols, not that it’s only Catholic clergy doing the molesting.
sorry. I did see who you responded to but it literally sounded like someone christian who was adding on about catholics so had to put in my sarcastic two cents.
Hahaha phew, 'cause I read your post in a similar way 😂
I love all the statues, paintings, and knickknacks. They’re not necessary for prayer, but they can be nice when they’re well done.
I saw El Greco’s Assumption of the Virgin in Chicago a few weeks ago. It was really stunning.
Sure, the art can be beautiful, but I’m not sure of the relevance here? Doesn’t change that people pray to them all the time, in direct contravention of one of the Commandments of their religion, not does it unmolest a single child.
My personal take is that Jesus was a cool dude with some good ideas, but the majority of people who claim to follow his teachings don’t, and that’s why we are where we’re at.
The relevance is that conflating idolatry with the majority of Western art over the last two millennia is a little hyperbolic.
There is a lot of beautiful Catholic art. I understand the Muslim argument against portraying the human form, and they have some beautiful art and architecture.
But I like Christian art too.
Good thing I didn’t do that, then. I’m referring to the literal prayers to Mary, uttered before literal statues of Mary.
The statues or paintings (or reproductions) aren’t necessary to the prayers any more than the rosary beads are. I doubt you’ll find many Catholics who would claim the objects held much importance other than being something to look at or hold. The same goes for the candles, incense, and vestments. They’re fun props, but most people understand they’re only that.
Some people don’t like them, and that’s okay too. I don’t understand the appeal of Southern Baptist services or church buildings.
My reading of the text forbids praying to gods other than the One True God or to graven idols, rules which the practices of Catholicism break on the regular. That’s my opinion, based on the text as written, and it’s not changing unless the text does.
As to the practice itself, I couldn’t give a shit beyond the fact that it makes Catholics who pray to saints hypocrites. If you want to defend it, defend it to your god, but I’m pretty sure he’d prefer the rampant child abuse to be taken care of first.
#👍
Those are Catholics. I only pray to God.
There’s a lot of christian cults. You’re only describing catholics here.
I was raised catholic and kids in other christian cults called me a devil worshipper.