They are not struggling. They are not even trying.
Instead they spent all their influence to keep the internal combustion engine alive at all costs.
I’m sure CCP subsidies pay some part, but western automakers also have themselves to blame for treating EVs as nothing but luxury products for the past decade. Western politicians also get some of the blame for not passing legislation that would’ve effectively forced automakers to change their ways.
It’s probably at least as important that the Chinese government decided on a forward looking policy, then applied it consistently over the time needed. That’s not “cheating”.
Also, I have yet to read any creditable comparison between their subsidies and our own. If you want me to feel outraged, you need a better case that they’re doing something different
California did pass those laws thirty years ago. Then Bush Jr rode up on his horse and got CA to neuter their law. That’s why GM made the ev1 then murdered it.
Toyota and Mercedes also had EVs back then they killed.
Were they sold in the US? I’ve never heard of those!
California. Electric Rav4, sold to fleets mostly, 1997-2003. Both Mercedes and Toyota were partnered with Tesla, but they bailed as soon as Musk showed up. Ford also had a Ranger EV.
Also, due to GM selling the patent for nicad/nimh ev batteries to Exxon, the other manufacturers had to stop selling their existing ev lineup. Then the world had to wait for lithium batteries to mature.
Mass procuced EVs have existed since like, the early 1900s. At the time, 28% of the cars on the road in the US were EVs. They lost to ICE cars because their range was too small, they were too slow, and they were too expensive. In the 1910s EVs were double the price of an ICE car, and since they were selling so badly most auto makers stopped making them.
I’m not sure the tech was there yet 30 years ago. EVs live and die by lithium batteries. The EV1 apparently used lead acid.
However, ten years ago the situation was entirely different.
Ev1 switched to NiMH in year 2.
Which was then bought by an oil company to hinder the development and deployment of the tech.
I doubt that. NiMH were used in hybrids up to 2022.
Yeah you’re right, I watched a video on it a few days ago and I could’ve sworn that’s what he said but actually thinking about it that can’t be right.
NiMH just became outdated when lithium became available.
The US auto industry will do anything but make cars people want to drive
That’s not true they make those increasingly larger trucks for men with penis insecurities.
It’s not just the US. There is exactly one new car by any car company anywhere that I would like to drive and that’s the ID3 Neo.
As an owner of an ID3, it’s a great car. But I also find it very expensive, especially if you are looking for things that I would now consider basic (like the rear camera, that is optional on a minimum 30k€ car). And don’t get me started that you have to pay to “unlock” more HP on your car (that is just a small piece of software).
I really just want something that looks like a normal car and has switches and buttons and isn’t too big
That’s apparently extremely hard in the era of SUVs and huge tablet displays… At least for the second there is some pushback
I’m worried that, due to the requirement of having a massive battery pack under the floorboards, we won’t ever have something that doesn’t look like an SUV
Just look at the new “Ferrari”
Technology will catch up. Batteries today have a capacity of around 250w/kg, but in the lab they are already 400-500w/kg. At some point “range anxiety” stops being a real issue, and then you don’t need to cram as many batteries as you can anymore, and you focus on optimizing what you already have.
Everything else in an electric car is already more compact than an ice equivalent.
Okay then my other worry is that people will be so used to buying SUVs that car makers won’t make anything else.
Which has already happened.
There’s 0 for me. Luckily my car only has 50k miles and doesn’t have all the dumb tech or split headlights (yuck).
US automakers at one point saw that they could build a sedan for 25k and sell it 28k, but could build a truck for 30k and sell it for 40k! So they basically killed all sedans!
This is basically every company now. Profit over everything, including customer satisfaction.
Unfortunately it’s the right choice. Otherwise you get gobbled up by others doing it. And with the wage gap being as wide as it is it no longer makes sense to try to sell a lot of things to the lower middle class, instead fewer more expensive things to the upper class.
It sucks ass. But California and one other place have legislation they’re trying to pass I think that says it the wage gap at a company is so large taxes go way up based on the gap and they use the taxes to help fix the gap. So hopefully that works out…!!
It would help if consumers just had a freaking spine. When you see they’re trying to hose you, just find another retailer. If there’s no other retailer, do without or find it used.
It’s hard to send a message buy not buying a car that you can’t afford to buy anyway… or conversely, buy a car you approve of and is exactly what you want/need but again you don’t have money to do so.
Voting with your wallet is only so effective.
More consumers not being able to afford a new car is a message by itself. Voting with your wallet is not as impactful as good legislation but more effective than rolling over and taking the shit deal.
Yup, that’s what we do. But we’re in a place where we can and have the bandwidth to do it.
Unfortunately people can’t care about everything or have bandwidth for it. I used to care a ton about starving people in Africa, then I got married and had kids. Not that Africa isn’t important, but my bandwidth shifted.
Car manufacturing is bizarrely inefficient by legacy makers. Across a dozen models, they make bespoke parts for every model. Why does Ford need 12 different turn signal stalks, or door handles, or why does every single model need a different seat design?
It’s unfortunate, but car enthusiasts and reviewers absolutely shit on manufacturers for sharing parts across models and brands. “Parts bin” is used as a pejorative. Even though it means cheaper and better spare parts availability.
That’s the car media…which is the propaganda arm of the industry. They will wax on about vehicles, but never, ever, tell you if they are reliable or admit some brands just chronically make overpriced junk.
People are fucking stupid. Chevrolet made a very affordable sports car with the Corvette C6 that outperformed various euro douche brands, but people could not get over the steering wheel was used on a Chevy Cobalt.
When I hear parts bin I dont go straight to the negative I typically see it as creative like how some parts on some laborghinis share parts with completely different other cars (iirc one had headlights from a Nissan)
Lamborghini uses a lot of AUDI parts under the hood. They went broke making all their own parts.
“Why do auto makers need 12 different variants of the same part?”
To make getting the parts more difficult and more expensive so you buy an new car instead. They all do it. They don’t want their cars to be serviced, just bought and replaced. ICE, Hybrid, EV, all the same. Auto makers want all cars to be disposable in as little time as possible.
You mean like gluing in battery cells into one solid block with the frame so that when a few cells die off the whole car needs to be junked?
ThE gReEn rEvOlUtIoN
If capitalists wanted me to care they shouldn’t have moved all manufacturing off shore anyway
USA: no car using less than 5 wheels shall be allowed to drive in the USA.
I’m happy if EV becomes the norm and they manage to make them interesting to drive.
What I fear is a lack of repairanility, as I wouldn’t get a new car just because its battery is dying.
I’m gonna keep my ICE family (2018 Seat Leon Cupra 300 St 4Drive) car for at least 10 more years before switching to an EV, with a fun ICE car on the side. I hope, by then, it’ll be easy to find repairable EV cars.
I recently sold my RAV4 and bought an EV. I will tell you that it absolutely does not make sense to buy an EV unless you can charge your car while you’re at home or at work. If you’re happy to drive your existing ICE vehicle until the wheels fall off, go for it. My commute made it make sense for me to sell a car that was still in pretty good condition while it still had good value in order to trade up, but that’s not always sensible for every case.
Repairability is a bit of a concern, but it’s not like you throw the whole thing away over one little issue. It is made up of parts and the parts can be replaced piecemeal as needed like other cars. But no transmission, no oil changes, no spark plugs, no radiator, etc. My only scheduled maintenance is rotating and replacing tires, replacing headlight bulbs and wiper blades, and brakes, but the brakes see less use due to regen braking.
The battery issue is also not as big of an issue as you’d think. Just be mildly strategic with how and when you charge, and it lasts longer. And it reaching the end of its life isn’t a quick and catastrophic death so much as it is a gentle diminishing of range. My car’s original range was 250 miles. I bought it used 4-5 years after release and it still gets like 230 miles on 100% charge. But I only charge up to 75% for my unusually long 90ish mile round trip daily commute, and I just plug in when I get home. I could charge even less, but it’s probably best for battery longevity to keep the battery between 20% and 80% unless there’s a good reason not to. My family is taking a long road trip in it next week, so I’ll charge up to 100% ahead of that and probably ahead of coming back. It will take a little more planning than a gas car would, but the infrastructure is there such that it won’t be that complicated to map out charging locations along the way.
The tech is here when you’re ready for it. But again, it really doesn’t make much sense for you to make the change now while you have a fairly new, well-running vehicle, especially if you don’t already have home charging set up. But if you’re serious about eventually switching, start researching charging equipment and your home’s power availability and your typical range needs. Most Americans don’t drive more than like 20-30 miles, and park their car for over 12 hours, so if that’s you, then you could just use level 1 charging off a standard outlet. I opted for more, but again, I’m an unusual case.
Cheers!
Thanks for the detailed experience.
For me it’s really a long term project so really no rush.
But it’s always good to get informations and follow the evolution of a « new » technology.
Yeah. I’ve literally seen a car seller today. I’m gonna buy a Chinese electric next month. The range and functions that come with the car are unmatched for the price.
