- cross-posted to:
- lemmyshitpost@lemmy.world
- cross-posted to:
- lemmyshitpost@lemmy.world
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If you can’t get a job in your field with a graduate degree, why does anyone think that if you get a master’s, suddenly the jobs will appear?
Usually, you need a lot of less skilled workers, and as you go up in skill, the demand for the numbers of workers goes down. So getting something more advanced/specialized may actually shrink your pool of options.
Plus, people with entry jobs with graduate degrees are more likely to shift jobs because someone is offering a higher skill position with more pay, so entry jobs should become available more frequently. In contrast, highly specialised jobs requiring the masters degree and whatnot will have some quadragenarian holding it as a salaried/tenured employee.
that was me in the 80s, so nothing really changes without a ton of actual luck. and yes i tried mechanic school, and welding school. got nowhere with either one. do have the skills to make and fix my own stuff though, which i wouldn’t trade for a desk job
easiest way to get a job is to have daddy hire you at his company or call a friend to get you job at theirs.
and then lecture and look down on folks who are struggled to get jobs because they don’t have a daddy like that.
otherwise you’re gonna struggle and struggle until you get a lucky break. the average job search is 3-6 months, which mean often it’s longer than that. a lot of places will take 1-2 months to hire you from start to finish. my first job took 3 months to hire me from first interview, which was in late oct, and I didn’t start until Feb. and of course once I was hired in December, I got multiple interviews and 2 more offers… because that’s how life works. after months of nothing.
yeah my daddy was in prison back then. he didnt give that much of a shit about me anyway.
To be fair I was like that when I was 23 a long ass time ago, too…
First job out of college was a tiny Medical IT company with maybe a dozen employees. Started at $15/hr while they billed me at $80. Spent seven years polishing my resume (should have been out the door at 3, but I was naive and they did up my pay to $35/hr before I’d finally left).
All that is to say, your starting salary isn’t forever. Five and ten years of experience counts for a lot.
But staying in the service sector is a dead end. The most dogshit small time IT job is better than carting boxes around, if you want to work in IT. The grungiest nursing job is better than flipping burgers if you want to work in medicine.
Put years on a resume and keep looking for new opportunities. But don’t get stuck in the quagmire of retail, unless you actually want to try and climb that career path into management or supply chain or whatever.
And absolutely, stay the fuck out of masters programs. That’s for people who have a job lined up, not people looking for work.
Or for people to get at night after they already have a job.
The only 23 year olds who didn’t go through this phase… were the people who had family connections to get them a 100K job after graduation.
rest of us took 6-9 months to find work, often while doing part time stuff to pad or resumes. if you don’t have connections getting a job is difficult and takes a lot of work.
we also had degrees from frickin’ Harvard. but we had no connections and no idea how the real world worked. I got my first real job 8 months after graduating, after working full time all summer and part time the entire fall. and i was living away from home, off my savings that entire time.
The only 23 year olds who didn’t go through this phase… were the people who had family connections to get them a 100K job after graduation.
Idk about that. I knew plenty of people who got entry level jobs at Schlumberger or Dell or corporate equivalent, earning $70k+ walking in the door.
If you had top grades and interviewed well, it’s possible. But we’re talking college grads and maybe one in five or one in ten, depending on your school. It wasn’t the “normal” experience. But it wasn’t pure nepo shit either.
rest of us took 6-9 months to find work, often while doing part time stuff to pad or resumes. if you don’t have connections getting a job is difficult and takes a lot of work.
Spent six months volunteering at a literacy center, which gave me some glowing references and a genuinely good feeling about getting up in the morning in the intermediate time.
Also spent a bunch of time at the gym, which was great once I got back into the dating scene.
While college sure aint the answer to everything, spending your days jerking off and watching TV sure aint the answer either.
Pretty sure wanking doesn’t take him all day. Jerking off is not the problem.
1: is your name a reference to the stormlight archives
2: the person self describes their life as jerking and TV watching, don’t think OP is being unfair
Why does he not say what his bachelor’s degree is in? It seems highly relevant
It’s not.
what’s relevant is his work history and how he is applying for jobs. i hire for my company. lots of people have shitty worthless resumes and letters because they literally don’t know how the apply to jobs. and then a chunk of those with recent applications, dont’ reply or interview terribly.
but they are 22/23, they don’t know this shit and they have to learn it.
we dont’ give a fuck what your degree is in, but we expect a demonstration of professional competence and the ability to tell us how your skills would apply to the job. and most people can’t do this… they apply with boilerplate language that shows us they didn’t read the job description or they resume highligths irrelevant things. copy pasting the same application to every job is the best way to ensure no employee ever looks at it.
and we dont’ even get a ton of applications, we’re a small company with no clout, we maybe get 30 applications per position, not like 300 or 3000. but typically 90% are trash and we might try to contact/interview 3 people for 1 offer.
we’ve honestly hired people from shitty no name schools over people with more relevant degrees and from fancy schools… because their application was relevant and in the interview they showed competence and maturity and the ability to process new information. a lot of folks freak out and freeze up and can’t answer basic questions, like how their degree/work history is relevant to what we are looking for in an employee, so they don’t get hired.
i got hired on the spot basically because during my interview I asked them questions about their security postures and practices, and like their upgrade timelines… which all showed I knew what the fuck I was talking about and had experience doing IT operations. they told me later that out of various other people and previous employees, not a one of them had shown that level of curious and engagement with the job and often they ended up being shitty employees.
a lot of applicants have no idea what your job involves skillwise. company names dont always give a hint, and unless youre a huge conglomerate youre media footprint is miniscule at best.
unless it’s like written in the job description, which it almost always is.
but it’s true that many candidates, can’t frickin’ read, or don’t bother to.
Truth. This is sadly something you learn after landing your first job, not before.
My eye opening moment was seeing the technical guy at the interview light up when I said I’m open to learning their domain knowledge. I didn’t have a degree, but I made up for it by showing interest in the field by doing my own projects, as a hobby. I was the only guy in the department without a degree for a long time.
First job hunt took a while, second and third was basically on the spot, first application sent.
You’d really like to think so.
But a 4.0 GPA will get you a job basically anywhere, because managers assume you’re a quick study. Sub-3.0 means they think you’re lazy or hard headed. When you’re skating near 2.0, you can have a degree in Rocket Science and recruiters will just assume you sucked at it.
Worked at a tech company that was hiring anyone with a 3.5+ from Data Scientists to English Lit majors. Then they just throw everyone into New Hire Training and gave them a coding crash course. The English Lit kids didn’t do any worse than the STEM crowd on the tech side. And they were way better at collaboration, documentation, and delivery.
This is how revolutions start. Some smooth talker is going to come along and motivate all these people to do something wonderful or terrible.
My group of buddies always say that if gaming hadn’t become so wildly popular a revolution started by young men would have happened already.
The US is really good at placating the masses with media. Stay distracted, stay oppressed.
Bread and circuses. A concept thousands of years old.
Yeah but the rich forgot to keep paying for the bread and circuses.
Don’t worry, gaming is quickly becoming unaffordable to anyone without a serious income stream.
im broke and im gaming on a borderline e-waste pc (which i bought for cheap used) and a steam deck from pre-price hike and buying games off humble bundle and deep discounts on steam
i also have a ps4 pro (which i bought used for next to nothing) from before i moved to this tiny apartment and could do couch gaming
it’s possible but you gotta not buy the latest and most expensive games. idk why anyone would do that in the first place tho, theres so many games to play that are just as good and are way cheaper
but they fund the development of those games tho so i dont mind i guess 🤷
Gaming systems are made for the top 10% now. They are fully rejecting regular consumers and focusing entirely on the high end market.
Basically they want to cater the economy to the top 10% and neglect the bottom 90%. This is one reason why everything is so damn expensive. Budget options aren’t a thing anymore.
Hahaha ! “We would start a revolution but we’re too busy gaming on the couch”. What a bunch of losers indeed.
Uhh, yes. Unironically. Revolutions happen when a sufficient number of people can’t afford to game & jack off any more, so their only source of entertainment is to LARP overthrowing the government, which they do so realistically that it actually happens. Open a history book smh.
If you look into it at all, America is a really embarrassing place.
I mean, we just started an unprovoked war by bombing a school full of little girls.
If someone has done that to America, there’d already be memorials about it and several random brown countries bombed back to the stone age, but since we did it, it’s actually totally cool.
It always has been. That’s why alternate history is taught.
We can’t even get gamers to stop pre-ordering games from even just the shitty companies. They literally can’t simply go play any of the thousands of other amazing games because they’re too busy letting themselves get rat-fucked by companies like EA and Ubisoft who actively hate their customers.
deleted by creator
4chan and reddit were instrumental in the election of Trump (45). CMV.
Reddit’s boner for Ron Paul in 2008 was a proof-of-concept for leveraging social media to astroturf. CMV.
Why do you think ghislane was power-moderating reddit until 2019 and eglin was [redacted] {user has unfortunately died in a vehicle collision and subsequent lithium fire}
Yeah because this guy is totally trying to be a useful member of society with his lounging around all day watching TV.
I bet back in the day people wished Hitler kept jerking off 3 times a day and painting.
It almost feels like my own lifs
Me too, thanks.
The world will always need electricians (and if society collapses you’ll have the knowledge to not die when salvaging parts from the clankers that countries sent in after they ran out of human meat for the grinder)
Why are people talking like being a mechanic is bum work, or like there’s a huge overhead cost in being a mechanic, or that you have to go to trade school to be a mechanic, or like mechanic work is going away?
None of these is true.
Mechanics will always have work, usually with overtime, and usually pay is very decent.
No degree required. Certs optional.
Tools are very affordable when you’re not buying them all at once.
Lots of room to change specializations.
ICE mechanics are still going to be hugely in demand because the Internal Combustion Engine isn’t going anywhere, even if they stop putting them in some/ most automobiles. But there are dozens of other mechanical disciplines, and as long as you know how to (when to) then a wrench, you can always get a job.
A bearing is a bearing, whether it’s on a crank shaft, an electric motor, a tail pulley, or a garage door.
do you know any mechanics?
every mechanic I have met hates their life, unless they work for like a really high end place. and those jobs are far and few.
i had family in auto work, electricians, and line workers. they all basically said ‘go to college working in the trades is fucking shit.’
working in an office is a lot easier on your body and doesn’t leave you with medical problems. my electrician uncle lost one leg in his 50s and then other in his 60s. the mechanics i knew all worked for their dads and were townies we never left where they grew up, etc.
they made decent money, sure, but i would never ever want to trade live with them. i’m in my 40s and healthier than I was in my 20s. money isn’t everything.
I… uh… i am a mechanic. I just don’t work in a car shop that pays only billable hours. Why would you do that to yourself?
That would be like getting a minimum wage serving job and hoping the tips will be reliable. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
I never struggle for hours, I have great benefits, non- union, no certs, degrees, or specialization required. I make enough to pay all my bills, invest in retirement, and still have money left over for life afterward. I work with a gang of guys all doing the same. We work in a field where we can go pretty much anywhere and get another job paying about the same.
I’m not sure why the mechanics you have met can’t find these jobs, but they have all misinformed you.
i work in IT. it’s so easy, just get a six figure job like me.
it’s not that the vast majority of positions in the field… are part time contract work that pay shit… and jobs like mine are difficult and rare to find and typically only go to those with tons of experience or elite degrees, like myself. it’s not that 22 year olds even struggle to get those shit jobs that get their foot in the door.
or that it took me over a decade of experience and working to get to this wage level… no it’s not that.
i also don’t understand why 22 year olds don’t have 500K in assets and just buy houses instead of renting and living with roommates, it’s so easy!
Wow, you have it hard in IT i guess. Maybe you should have looked into being a mechanic.
You don’t need a degree to get jobs as a mechanic, so no formal education necessary. You don’t have to worry about jobs being hard to find because basically everything that moves has bearings that need to be changed. You don’t need to worry about contract work because there are substantial amounts of mechanic jobs that pay hourly and offer tons of overtime.
I’m not sure why it’s so offensive to you that plenty of people don’t have the experience you heard about from “every mechanic you met.”
the average mechanic wage is 50K a year. average IT job wage is 100K a year.
that’s not a livable wage unless you live in bumfucksville parts of the USA, and the mechanics that live there are not making 50K, they are making like 30K.
but please tell me how everyone should go be a mechanic and they’ll make 150K a year? i guess?
just because you got lucky or did well, doesn’t not mean every other person will have the same luck or skill in their career.
you certainly are not educated. you’ve made that very clear but your insistence ignorance that being a mechanic is ‘so easy’.
Wow, for someone so educated, you sure make a lot of odd assumptions.
Perhaps I am more educated than you assume, even if a formal education is not required for my job.
Also, I’m gonna make an assumption now about your education, based on things you’ve said here… someone as condescendingly smart as yourself and using averages to discuss things like this has certainly taken at least some statistics classes and understands what a “standard deviation” is… and how that might be affected by extremely low paying jobs in one sector, even if those are not the most prominent paying jobs or abundant positions in that sector.
I think the standard deviation of pay for mechanics is much wider than you think, and possibly skewed by other factors than just simple geography.
I’m not saying that all mechanics make IT wages, but i am saying that I didn’t have to spend 10 years in school and $150k in debt to compete for a position that I earn 6 figures in. My job is not competitive for positions, they’re pretty abundant. Base pay for this position in my area (not a big city) is substantially higher than the national “average.” No formal education required.
But I must ask, why u so mad bro? Sounds like you’re living the dream life, no need to have an aneurism about other people’s money
HAAANK DONT ABBREVIATE INTERNAL COMBUSTION ENGINE HAAANK
shop rate around me $180/hr now. the mechanics better be making at least a quarter of that. my company only charges half that rate for custom machine building
Trade work is admirable work. Never downplay fields that allow overtime. My best salary years are in an industry that allows unlimited OT.
I must be a psycho for thinking people should be paid more rather than work themselves to death.
It’s a cold world to live in when people think like this.
It can be both, can’t it?
People should be paid a living wage. If you do more work than is the defined norm you should be paid increasingly more sums of money.
The intent of overtime laws was to encourage companies to hire someone else instead of making someone work 80 hours a week.A business saying that they’ll pay you more if you work more at your discretion doesn’t bother me. Even with a perfectly good wage and benefits you’re going to have cases where people want a touch more more money. I had a coworker who did contracting jobs to pay for a new deck. He didn’t have to, but it kept his budget from getting weird.
I’d rather have the ability to pickup an extra shift when times are tough. I have my friends that are on a strict 40 hour week and when the check doesn’t cut it they are fucked. OT has allowed me a lot of luxuries I otherwise would have had to scrimp and save for.
Meanwhile most people are fucked if their car breaks down. I just pick up an extra shift and the problem goes away.
Thats exactly the point, if you are on a 40h week and that doesnt cut it, something is very wrong. If you say to work extra as a bonus, well maybe. But if you need it to make ends meet it’s completely fucked imo.
I’d rather times not be tough, but it seems that’s no longer allowed.
I worked 3300 hours a few years back. I was not prepared for what the overtime would do to my taxes. Still brought home more than I ever had before (or since). Also was not prepared what the overtime would do to my personal life or my mind.
Yup two years ago I worked just over 3500 hours. I basically lived at work to help put my wife through college and hold down the fort.
It was very difficult but worth it.
Mechanic pay is ass these days. I wouldn’t recommend it to anyone unless it’s like specialized and unionized.
How much do you think mechanics get paid today?
They make a good living, but they are paid flat rate, and there is no guarantee that there will be steady income. If there’s a lul, the mechanic might make $0 in a given week. Also, if for some reason a job takes longer than the billable hours for that job, they are essentially working for free. Of the trades, it’s the shittiest one to make good money in imo.
so many bozos on the internet they know what these fields are like, and it shows they know nothing.
folks who post how wonderful it is have survivorship bias. your average mechanic/plumber/electrician isn’t making bank, they are making average to below average wage. and the income is not steady, it’s sporadic. you might make 100k one year and 60 the next, or spend 2 years with minimal income because construction market or similar is slowing down.
This thread has a lot of people saying things like “don’t get a degree” or “get a trade cert” or “work in a different field to get experience” which I feel completely side-steps many issues and the realities that many people face. It’s just a fundamentally broken system. The value of degrees fluctuates so much because of a political climate that has the stability of a pane of glass being violently thrown off of a building and a job market that prioritizes either posting ghost jobs to overwork employees to death or outsourcing its candidate search to whoever can guess the most buzzwords in an application.
gets a degree in public health to help humanity
Trump completely ousts public health and replaces it with dodgy supplements
While volatile is a good way to describe the day to day. It’s been trending worse for many years now.
worse for whom?
if you are making 100K or more, you’re doing great.
Hard disagree. Tax breaks don’t get that low. Nobody making 100k is setting up shell companies and passing on generational wealth. That’s food security, a decent vehicle, and enough buying power to get a mortgage on a really cheap house.
It’s not nothing, but you’re not doing great. You have the buying power of two people making 30k 20 years ago.
My father was able, as a tradesman 35 years ago to buy a house outright, have two cars, new clothes and a vactaion every year.
My 3 bedroom apt was $800 a month in a nice area in the early 2000’s
disgaree all you want. the facts are the facts.
bitching that you can’t have shell corporations or afford first class plane tickets is very different than not being able to afford food, fuel, or housing.
people who make 100K+ typically come from generational wealth. overwhelmingly. they had educated parents, overwhelmingly, etc.
you’re just mad you can’t afford a house, cool. i can’t afford one either, but I’m not mad about it. i own a condo instead.
i could also easily afford two kids in my condo. but i’m single because every idiot around me thinks you need 5000sq ft home to have two kids, and there is no point in having kdis unless you can take them 1st class to france every summer. but none of that is being poor or struggling, it’s being a delusional idiot who has absurd expecations that only the 1% can really afford.
the facts are the facts.
You gave no facts. The facts you manufactured is wrong AF.
Every developer out there who’s worked withint 3 hours of a large city is generational wealth?
Get outa here.
the vast majority of people who work in tech came from wealthy households, yes.
they don’t believe that, of course. they all think they are poor because their folks only rented a house every two weeks on the beach, and didn’t own a beach front home.
every rich asshole thinks they aren’t rich, because someone else is richer than them. but if you’re parent sincome and your income are over 100K, you’re doing better than 90% of other people in the USA. just because you can’t see that doesn’t make it true.
where i live people make 300-500K a year and are convinced they are poor and struggling and have it worse than migrant farm workers. because at least those migrant farm workers have a house back in mexico. i have heard this bullshit multiple times in the past few years.
the vast majority of people who work in tech came from wealthy households, yes.
You’re not even arguing in good faith, welcome to blocked
What was the point of any of this?
Rebranded indentured servitude. You would think educators would be smart enough to not participate in this exploitation of the workingclass.
I guess the smart people aren’t in charge anywhere, not even in the education system.
That’s just misdirected. The people who teach and educate, at least from what I’ve seen (and mind you, I’m from Europe from a country that doesn’t have a for-profit university system in place), are quite often just passionate about their topic. Them being part of the same messed up system as you doesn’t mean they’re the ones to blame.
Me too brotha, me too…crank that hog for me one time please o7
Can confirm a Masters is pointless. Especially when everyone else at your table in the pub has a PhD.
I’m laughing to think what happens when the market is saturated with PhDs.
Will everyone need to be a professor to be competitive?
I wasn’t actually in competition with them at least, as they were all post-docs I know. The masters never did anything for my career in software that starting a year earlier wouldn’t have done better, except that the state paid for my ales.
I feel like I’m alone with this one, but if you have options, swallow your pride and take them. It’s a paycheck, and can always lead to something better. I took a paycheck job at a retail store and I’m on the management team. Is it something to brag about? God no, it sucks. But my bills are paid and I can advance.
my brother is unemployed for 5 years now. but it’s entirely because he’s a cunt who won’t take a lower paycheck or work for a company he thinks is ‘below’ him. he has more or less fucked himself because he thinks he should be only be hired for top level positions. the industry he is in also shrank a lot and he refuses to change industries.
I don’t remember ever commenting on 4chan…
You can always get a job as a prison guard. Sidebar, you get a job that’s below you and then start a business on paper that’s doing something relevant to your degree field and you hire yourself. Then you put that shit on your resume, wham bam thank you mam, one year later and some interview preparation you got your pick of the litter.
Would rather live in a giant vase than contribute to prison industrial complex.
There’s a reason they’re always hiring.
Prison guards make $55/hr, and I still wouldn’t give up my $21/hr job to work in a Vitamin D-deprived hellhole full of “customers” who hate you for merely existing.
Triple the pay, and maybe I’d consider it. Prison sucks.
There’s a reason they’re always hiring
I did this to become a programmer. No CS degree, learned to program by working on a personal project (music composition software), formed an LLC and sold the app as shareware back in the day when there was such a thing and people would pay $29.95 (!) for it. Still didn’t make nearly enough to live on, got a real job with a resume that listed my own company as my first employment. Wasn’t even dishonest about it, listed my role as “sole proprietor”. Maybe the people reviewing my resume didn’t know what a proprietor was.
TBF this was the '90s when Internet startups were hiring anything with a pulse.
Good shit, Although it seems you legitimately did something which is better. As always, can’t get a job? Hire yourself. Gotta work the system sometimes instead of just giving up. Also yeah soul proprietor doesn’t sound as fancy shmancy as CEO. They legit may not have been aware or understood you had the gumption to do something for yourself.
I would add in the modern context for people here to open a static website, have some social media account attached to the business with some content and that will really help with the legitimacy.
Yeah but this demonstrates exceptional interest, merit, and success.
