I shouldn’t have to say this but I do.
This is part of the
that “all cultures have to be basically feudal Europe but with variations”. No they don’t.
There’s a worldbuilding teacher called Grainbound who thinks that… well it’s there in his name. He goes on and on about how bad worldbuilders break the rule that grain-logistics determine the social order. He is the cure, teaching people grain-logisitcs so they can worldbuild the correct (feudal European) way.
This dataset ‘Cereal Grains the Principal Crop’ shows about 50% of societies surveyed were grain-dependent. And this dataset shows that of societies that got calories from agriculture (i.e. not hunter-gatherers) most got 46-75% of their calories that way.
There’s so many alternatives –
- Look up ‘Nuts As Staple Foods with Osker Brown’ on youtube… he talks with evidence about how hazelnuts and chestnuts have been used as the basic food. Californians were largely acorn-people (acorn+salmon). Mongongo/Manketti is the main food of many traditional Khoisan people. A tree, not a grain. Osker Brown is talking from his own experience of farming and eating as well as historical evidence.
- Root crops like the ones the Inca depended on. “Oh but they rot and can’t be stored like grain!” Think again: they stored chuño in qullqa.
- Pastoralism, herding camel or cattle or llamas or xcaiuds. Here are the data on dependence on animal husbandry: very high in the northern and horny parts of Africa.
- Non-domesticated animals, e.g. the buffalo-people of North America, or the Inuit.
- The Norte Chico (Caral-Supe) civilization recently owned the libs by proving that you don’t even need agriculture for organised civilisation. There were mobile hunter-gatherer bands without centralised populations and architecture. There were also sedentary hunter-gatherer civilisations with architecture.
You are also allowed to be imaginative in worldbuilding. What about a civilisation that gets most of their calories from seaweeds? Aquatic plants grow quicker than terrestrial plants, so they’d have more abundant food.
What about a civilisation that gets most of their calories from Black Soldier Fly larvae? That seems entirely possible to me.
Where Mr. Thegrainbound Dot Com is good is thinking through how food-logistics determines the social order. Can the food be taxed easily? Over what distances can it be transported? What logistical issues vanish with a particular food-source? What new ones are introduced? For example, pastoralism means your food can walk. The buffalo-folk migrated because the food migrated.
I think there’s some truth in the idea that grain-agriculture leads to states (James C. Scott and a lot of anarchists have thought about this) because it’s a fungible, taxable, store-able food. It’s a lot more money-like than a fruit is, and you can build a bureaucracy on it, and therefore a centralised state. But unless you’re building a centralised state, you don’t have to default to grain ‘just because’. Someone recently told me I should change my Faroes-style sheep-and-fish realm to be grain-dependent.
In the same way people on stackexchange worldbuilding have the attitude “I can accept telepathic penguins, so long as it’s a free-market economy”, grain-obsession is another version of that, a sub-belief in the same paradigm.
i didnt know this was the worldbuilding community so i thought this was presenting a new radical ideology weve never seen before.
I was halfway through a sort of angry post before I realized

But having a fictional sorghum based society increases the amount of times you get to use the word “sorghum”.
A poorly fitted mouthguard increases the amount of times I say “sore gum”
Sorghum is also objectively beautiful.
Youtube has populated my algorithm with “The Political Rules your World needs!” and similarly titled, prescriptive video essays.
I enjoy Artifexian and using real world climate science to inspire world building, but people trying to copy his style are lacking in creativity.
I really loved the world building in the Mistborn series. Lots of climate related shit going on too since the god emperor tucked everything up by moving the planets orbits around. It’s been a while and I should read those again.
Brando never really thinks about food systems though, and his states are only presented in the simplest terms. I’d like to see his attentiveness to world building explore those ideas, but maybe that’s not reasonable for an idealist lib.
Yeah I would love to see more of that too. I did like the way he did the whole industrial revolution stuff with the sequel series though.
European feudalism
China and Japan are like RIGHT THERE
Rice says hello
yeah that’s my point
How I build a civilization
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take a JRPG
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take a town that’s Pog
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scramble its name a little bit
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create a guy who lives there
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think of a fuck ass arc name (e.g. 7 spoons arc)
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create a story that could plausibly happen in that arc in that town
6.5) this informs the guy’s backstory (optional)
- render cinema
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I remember a video where he talked about how cities with millions of people are unrealistic in fantasy settings because of the limitations of feudal agriculture - completely ignoring, of course, the possibility of a steampunk or dieselpunk fantasy setting with combine harvesters and chemical fertilizers.
China and India had massive populations for thousands of years, many cities contained millions even millenia ago. Even Rome and Constantinople had a solid mill at various points.
it’s quite “simple” to inflate a city’s size you just need to pay a shitton to move a lot of food there. before capitalism cities usually didnt independently have the funds to do so, but an imperial government could organize it even with fantastically inefficient agriculture (Rome)
one thing is that such feats do require stable staple grains in order to facilitate shipping large surpluses to that location
Baghdad reached like a million people when vikings were a thing. Hangzhou and Kaifen both had more.
You can just do things.
or freakin magic
bioreactors with edible yeast and precision fermentation are close to magic: grow kilograms of food in a barrel in your kitchen. Then there’s no logistical issues with food, spaceships can be self-sufficient.
tbh, regardless of plausibility, multimillion feudal cities just instinctively feel a bit stupid about 90% of the time
I’d just use explanations like widely practiced disciplines of magic that enhance the yields of crops to serve greater populations. Maybe methods to enchant or bless soil or the water used for irrigation, increasing fertility & soil nutrients. Devices to harvest faster and more efficiently are just one of thousands of ways to justify little anachronisms, because it’s fantasy











