- cross-posted to:
- sino@hexbear.net
- technology@hexbear.net
- cross-posted to:
- sino@hexbear.net
- technology@hexbear.net
“If we want more growth, we need to allow creative destruction so new companies can deliver the productivity we need.”
Octopus energy ceo greg jackson
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If we want more growth (…)
We don’t.
The population tends to grow. Even if it stays stable, how do you envision the improvement of people’s quality of life without growth?
“If we want more growth, we need to allow creative destruction so new companies can deliver the productivity we need.”
Octopus energy ceo greg jackson
Well I don’t really want more growth or “creative destruction.”
Not really. Many of us have known for a long time that electrification was the obvious way forward. The reason others don’t is that the O&G industry are hindering progress through media.
Also the USD was backed by oil. The US would never allow countries to truly decarbonize since it undermines the value of the dollar.
“allow countries” - 😆 that isn’t how world politics works
Are you at all familiar with the last 80 years of world politics? Or the function of the CIA?
Effectively it does, we are so dependent on thebus in so many ways, whenever we do something they dont like, they threaten to take something away or increase tariffs. In the end europe caves.
That isn’t what “allowing” means. And there is no caving. These are all ongoing negotiations and things keep changing.
So we don’t have Galileo for example, stopped supporting Ukraine and supported the Iran war efforts of the US like in Iraq?
Somehow US media always brings those “why Europe sucks at things” articles, even on topics where the EU is actually holding up substantially better than the US, like electrification of road vehicles of all categories and domestic industries staying in that business. That said, Europe is certainly in a death struggle against Chinese competition but things are not nearly looking as lost as with the domestic US industry in the sector.
I really do not like people boasting about how foreign dictatorships are doing everything better while bashing our local democracies. If this guy wants to see an electric truck, he can simply walk onto European streets. They are there. And they are available from those “incubent manufacturers” that he bashes in the article.
There are 50 ton e-trucks available and rolling in Europe? Please, tell me more. That is very interesting.
Electric Trucks are limited to 42 tons in the EU and there are good reasons for that. That really doesn’t change much in this argument - we also do no have those australian road trains and that is also fine
I really do not like people boasting about how foreign dictatorships are doing everything better while bashing our local democracies.
I mean, electrification is one area where China is significantly and undoubtedly outdoing every single democracy out there. How democratic China is has no bearing on that fact.
Norway walks into the room.
I don’t know if I agree. A dictatorship decides to make more batteries and so the industry bends. Land is taken by the state to build mines. Little regard for the people or the environment.
All of this makes it easier for China to just move to electric, and part of why the EVs they export are so cheap.
They subsidise by environmental impact and possibly human suffering.* Not to mention they own the battery market.
I don’t think there’s a country in the developed world with a government that finds it distasteful to subsidize the consumption of their populace with environmental and human suffering. Moral superiority isn’t the difference being spotlit here. I think China just controls more manufacturing of its own which makes pivoting their society more efficient
The question was about politics and economics, not morals.
I would hope not supporting suffering and destruction doesn’t need to be explicitly stated to be understood.Meanwhile the UK has royalty that live in opulent luxury whilst the working-class dwells in poverty. Their hayday of wildly looting and enslaving foreign nations is over. They have nothing.
I’m not sure the argument “EVs are bad for the environment actually” works as well as you think it does.
I wasn’t arguing that. The way China mines and processes lithium for battery manufacture, in which they’re the leading exporter by far due to their rich rare earth deposits, is destroying the surrounding areas.
That’s fair, but my point is: Is there any way to make lithium ion batteries otherwise? Like is there any evidence that for instance Australian lithium is “greener” so to speak?
I see, yes my understanding is that the process can be a lot cleaner and other countries do it (like the US), China just chooses to take cheap shortcuts to take stranglehold of the market, which they now have.
LMFAO! Wait until you read about the industrial revolution and the environmental destruction caused by Great Britain. Go suck your king’s cock.
Great contribution to the conversation
How democratic China is has no bearing on that fact.
It does matter because this is totally what chinese state propaganda is broadcasting to the world. The old playbook the soviets have been doing
That might be but then you have Audi with 87% less profit compared to the year before and that’s not Chinese propaganda. He might be wrong about the trucks but he isn’t about electrification.
ah yes, the old soviet ploy to make the everyone think their society is flourishing by… improving their society. damn sneaky commies
Yeah, improve society by murdering millions of people. And the result was really worth it because Russia or East Germany were really awesome places with a high standard of living in 1989.
It works every single time. It’s so sad.
America’s perennial trend of bombing foreign nations is so much better at… creating dead children.
It also happens to be true.
Have been seeing e-Atros in Switzerland and Germany daily during my commutes this year, they are everywhere if you keep your eyes open.
Small sample from the US but I’ve seen some all-electric Penske trucks making deliveries to nearby warehouses. Day-cab semis with full 52’ trailers
https://www.pensketruckleasing.com/truck-leasing/leasing-services/electric-vehicles/
Penske doesn’t make trucks.
Peterbuilt has several EV models. So does MAC. The industry started R&D in electrics years ago.
True but the batteries in them still are from china.
Why has your map removed parts of Europe?
zealandosis
EU map
Wrong. What about Norway and Iceland? Why are they included?
It is a map of the EEA, which is EU + EFTA*
'* excluding CH, since they voted no.
Oh, hey another grouping of European countries that I didn’t know yet!
Is Liechtenstein included in this or not?
You can find the answer to that question and many others in the Wikipedia article on European integration.
That diagram is amazing.
The complexity - lol…
Yes, Liechtenstein is included. The Swiss voted against it in 1992, whereas the Liechtensteiners voted in favor.
I had to check because I was not sure but interestingly enough Liechtenstein is in fact member of the EEA, while Switzerland is not, even though Liechtenstein is in a customs and monetary union with Switzerland.
Bad news Norway…
It’s some weird map, looks to be Schengen with Switzerland removed and Ireland and Iceland added…
Have you been to China? It’s not a dictatorship.
He’s simply saying Europe is dragging it’s feet and allowing legacy companies to dictate the path to electrification.
Can’t read the graph but seems woeful for non scandi countries. Fact is the EU could be doing way better to stimulate green tech.
Have you been to China? It’s not a dictatorship.
It is a dictatorship, that’s basically a fact. It’s just a much better ran dictatorship than Russia. Sometimes the king is competent & even benevolent & so the kingdom can thrive.
Having been to China has very little to do with this, yes China has amazing infrastructure & whatever else, but this is not an argument in the dictatorship debate, in math terms A is true, B is true, but there is no connection.Yeah apologies. I was wrong.
I appreciate your willingness to learn and admit this so readily, don’t get me wrong. But how did you get here to this point without realizing China is a dictatorship?
I think when i saw the original comment I didn’t think it was fair to lump China in with the Gulf states as a dictatorship. I knew it was a communist, one party state but thought they wouldn’t classify themselves as a dictatorship.
In my other comment I looked it up and China does indeed call themselves a “people’s democratic dictatorship”.
Just got confused by all the terminology.
But the terminology doesn’t really matter, most especially what they call THEMSELVES.
Honestly, sorry, not trying to come across as hostile at all it’s just kinda truly confounding. China exerts far greater direct control over its citizens than any Gulf state.
North Korea calls itself the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea, btw
No worries, no hostility!
I think it’s hard because I’ve been there and saw a well functioning country where the people are happy and looked after. Public infrastructure was excellent. Certainly didn’t feel like a dictatorship.
As you say, terminology doesn’t really matter. Every system of governance is susceptible to corruption. From my POV I see China as a country that wants the best for it’s people. I see the flaws of democracy when targeted by extremely wealthy corporations and people.
Don’t get me wrong China has it’s flaws too. But to me it’s doing way better than the US, and the EU should look to strengthen ties.
AI Bot?
ACTCHULLY I’ve been to China, and since I’ve been that means it’s not. I just walked off the plane and they said, “Wow. This white guy arrived in our country, we are going to overthrow our government and implement a democracy - the best the worlds ever seen.”
My first night in China they all whipped out there phones and voted. 100% turnout. 100% of the votes went to the benevolent dictator. Fundamentally nothing changed. But I’m the reason why China has a democracy now.
Okay I am very impressed at what China is achieving in many fields and it’s truly more than impressive. I have lived in China for a year and I have going back a few times since. It is a dictatorship and you can fuck right off to .ml of you think otherwise
Apologies. Looked it up and you’re right! China is a self described dictatorship. Just a dictatorship of the people.
Is China a Dictatorship?
Given the degree of censorship and control China’s government leverages over its citizens, most political experts would call it a dictatorship. China’s constitution calls its government a “people’s democratic dictatorship.” This may sound like a contradiction of terms to many people. The premise of the “people’s democratic dictatorship” is that the Chinese Party of China and the state represent and act on behalf of the people, but possess and may use powers against reactionary forces. The People’s Republic of China is currently ruled by President Xi Jinping, who also serves as the General Secretary of the Communist Party of China, Chairman of the Central Military Commission, the country’s Vice President, the President of the Central Party School, and the 1st ranked member of the CPC Politburo Standing Committee.
Thank the right-wingers and conservatives who undermine green efforts at every turn.
Yeah and it is telling that you weren’t convinced by an affordable, simple and cheap electric hatchback commuter car, asshole.
