• DornerStan@lemmygrad.ml
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    21 hours ago

    First they came for the White Nationalists

    And I did not speak out

    Because it was based

    Then they came for the pro-Whites

    And I did not speak out

    Because it was based

    Then they came for the pro-Western Culturists

    And I did not speak out

    Because it was based

    Then they came for the anti-Marxists

    And I did not speak out

    Because it was based

    Then they came for the Christians

    And I did not speak out

    Because it was based

    Then they came for the Whites

    And I did not speak out

    Because it was based

    Then I still did not speak out

    Because there was no one left

    to come after me

  • Gowron_Howard@lemm.ee
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    24 hours ago

    Not just Christianity, but all religion being illegal would be a net positive for the world.

    • bdonvrA
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      22 hours ago

      I get where you’re coming from but the legal system is absolutely not the way to get there.

      I think better, more extensive education is the only way really. And we’ve been seeing that fruit over the past century as schooling became more universal (as compared to 100 years ago, of course.)

      The kind of educational system we’d have under a socialist world…

      • BeamBrain [he/him]@hexbear.net
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        20 hours ago

        I get where you’re coming from but the legal system is absolutely not the way to get there.

        Worst case scenario of this is something like France’s laicite which on paper is against all public flaunting of religion but in practice just means “fuck the Muslims.”

        • bdonvrA
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          19 hours ago

          Yeah, religious norms become social/societal norms - or at least heavily influence them.

          This becomes quickly problematic when you start thinking about how this can make it very easy to discriminate against more ethnic minorities/immigrants than anything since they’re more likely to dress differently (in a way that often is religiously influenced, even if they themselves aren’t devout)

      • Gowron_Howard@lemm.ee
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        20 hours ago

        Agreed. The legal system can still be manipulated and used to manipulate others. Education is truly the only way to rid the world of religion.

        • 9to5 [any, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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          23 hours ago

          It’s a meaningless wish.

          How are you going to enforce making all religion illegal?

          If attempted, I can’t think of anything more unifying and radicalizing for modern theists than this laughable attempt. That’s exactly how you’d probably end up with a new wave of hardcore theocracies.

          • SeasonalDepressionEnjoyer [she/her]@hexbear.net
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            22 hours ago

            It would be a generational process, not something immediate. Slowly educate and phase it out over time, until younger generations no longer see the need or rely on it as people do now. To act as if it is some completely impervious institution is just idiotic. It can’t be done immediately, but it can and should eventually be phased out.

            • Nakoichi [they/them]@hexbear.netM
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              22 hours ago

              This is white chauvinism bullshit. You gonna tell me you’re all for eradicating indigenous practices of colonized people. Because where you draw the line is important.

              • AtmosphericRiversCuomo [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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                21 hours ago

                “Eradicate” is overly charged. I don’t see any reason why ceremonies or cultural traditions would be erased by providing more scientific education to the masses.

                The knowledge of our ancestors can still be taught, and traditions upheld without literally believing that there are dieties or ghosts or whatever.

                I dunno, this just strikes me as the “veganism is flawed because indigenous people should be able to hunt” argument, but applied to religion.

              • SeasonalDepressionEnjoyer [she/her]@hexbear.net
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                20 hours ago

                Holy shit no. Though like with what 9to5 said any actual changes to religious or spiritual practices would be long after our times, but again there’s a bit of a false equivelency between exploitative structures like centralized churches and general practices of indigenous cultures. I have no issue with individual practice, just the structures that can arise from them.

                You’re overcorrecting due to the shitiness that is new atheism, and willfully blinding yourself to the issues that stand with organized religion.

            • 9to5 [any, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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              22 hours ago

              Alright, see, I can work with that. I don’t agree with it, but at least it’s more than a kneejerk reaction. The thing is, slowly phasing out religion or spirituality as a concept is something that would probably only happen long after the left has “won,” however that may look. So we are talking about something that is most likely not gonna happen within our lifetime if it ever happens. Its bascially a sci-fi at that point and at least right now not very relevant to the struggles or battles ahead.

      • AssortedBiscuits [they/them]@hexbear.net
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        17 hours ago

        In retrospect, they should’ve just kept the religious status quo but made every single member of the clergy be a card-carrying member of the CPSU subject to internal party discipline while banning all other “independent” churches. Religious dogma should incorporate things like “Jesus said communism rules and capitalism drools” and “the bourgeoisie go straight to hell when they die because the bourgeoisie are not human.” Christians who don’t accept Jesus’s teaching that communism is based get excommunicated and send to hell where the rest of the bourgeoisie are burning as well.

        Overall, China handled religion a lot better. There isn’t a hard push for state atheism (although I think the CPC is officially an atheist organization), but all religious groups have to swear loyalty to socialism with Chinese characteristics and submit themselves to the will of the socialist state. Those that don’t toe the socialist line like Falun Gong have the hammer dropped on them.

        The way the CPC handled Tibetan Buddhism is an illustrative example. Instead of abolishing a particular branch of Buddhism that used the skins of serfs for their drums, the CPC incorporated Tibetan Buddhism within the state apparatus. Whenever some religious leader dies and a new “reincarnation” has to appear to take their place, by sheer coincidence, the “reincarnation” who eventually appears is someone who the CPC liked the most.

        This is the way to go. People need to quit being Reddit atheists and think strategically about this.

      • Keld [he/him, any]@hexbear.net
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        21 hours ago

        State atheism was good actually. The orthodox church didn’t stop with their anticommunism before their marginalisation, during their marginalisation or after they were invited back. No amount of grace extended to the Orthodox or Catholic churches by communist movement has been received in good faith or with gratitude or had ever stopped them from trying to quell communism.

        Lenin said that the church is nothing but an instrument of bourgeois reaction, and the church has spent a century proving him right.

    • FourteenEyes [he/him]@hexbear.net
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      23 hours ago

      There is no paradox, tolerance is a social contract and the intolerant are those who reject it and are thus not entitled to tolerance themselves

      • ShinkanTrain@lemmy.ml
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        22 hours ago

        Most paradoxes aren’t true paradoxes, they’re just things that someone can’t solve with their current information or way of thinking. 🤓

        • DornerStan@lemmygrad.ml
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          16 hours ago

          literally “if I can’t describe an ethical standard in one sentence or less then it must be a paradox”

  • Angel [any]@hexbear.net
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    23 hours ago

    Illegal to be White.

    The same kind of people who tell BIPOC, “Racism doesn’t exist in this country anymore. Stop playing the victim!” as they gaslight us about the racism we’ve experienced act like the biggest victims ever just because they’re coated in mayo.