no! not only is it explicitly anticommunist, it’s a freakin’ both sides meme! it’s the hallmark of a radicalizing lib that hasn’t done any reading but “feels very strongly” about the issue and also feels very strongly when voices in their feed tell them they should read history before adopting self-defeating symbols
The symbol is for libs who lament that they don’t have their own swastika.
That SPD poster makes it pretty clear that we shouldn’t.
These antifascist symbols will suffice.
There’s no need to use reheated liberal anti-communism. Besides, people already know the antifa symbol with the flags because that’s the symbol that actual anti-fascists use in the real world.
I have a few copypasta/effort posts about this but the answer is FUCK NO
As a reaction to the Harzburg Front and the »March of 100,000«, the Reichsbanner, SPD, General German Trade Union Confederation (ADGB), General Employees’ Association (Afa-Bund) and workers’ gymnastics and Sportbund (ATSB) formed the “Iron Front” on December 16, 1931. Her symbol was three from top right to arrows pointing to the lower left, each shattering a crown, a swastika, and a hammer and sickle. The Iron Front therefore also saw itself as an anti-communist organization.
There was no actual membership. Rather, the Iron Front represented an attempt to to initiate a movement of pro-republic forces. Today they would probably be more democratic as a concerted action identify organizations against extremism
During the first months of its existence, the Iron Front was popularized through large-scale events. There were so-called “preparation weeks” in which activists could write their names in “iron books.” Trade unionists formed “hammer groups” in order to be able to act militantly in an emergency. In their propaganda appeared the Iron Front as a decisive force to protect the republic. In fact, their activities focused on publicly effective self-portrayals.
Meanwhile, the Nazis were gaining ground. Hitler wanted on April 10, 1932 in the election to the Reich President against Paul von Hindenburg and Ernst Thälmann, but he was still stateless. The German The Braunschweig government procured him citizenship by appointing him to the government council on February 25, 1932 in Berlin - a post that Hitler, incidentally, never took up. However, the election to the Reich President was decided by supported by the SPD, German nationalist Paul von Hindenburg for himself.
The day after Hitler was made chancellor, the standard bearers of this emblem did this
The KPD asked the Iron Front, the SPD, the general trade union association ADGB and their organisations, and the Reichsbanner Schwarz-Rot-Gold to declare a general strike against Hitler. The Iron Front decline, issued a call on February 2 to “all comrades of the Reichsbanner and the Iron Front”, warning against participating in “wild actions organised by irresponsible people”, and exhorted members to “turn all Iron Front events into powerful rallies for freedom”.
The attempt to use the Three Arrows is a restoration of the very liberal chauvinism that led to Hitler winning. It is a symbol of anti-communism and the people who try to restore it have largely been naive or downright dangerous. Oppose the Iron Front then and now.
We’ve been having this fight with neo-Iron Front/ironfrontusa people for years here https://hexbear.net/post/157623?scrollToComments=false
This is a symbol literally used by the opposition to Antifa. It is not, nor has it ever been anti-fascist. And if we wanted to use it, we should then cease using the two flags Antifascist Action emblem because using both is a denigration of the fallen.
RoteFront and Antifa comrades died fighting this shit.
AWAY WITH THE LIES OF THE IRON FRONT THE DECEIVERS OF THE PROLETARIAT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fn4-9G6azgwI found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:
the three arrows is a hate symbol as far as I’m concerned. I tear it down every time I see it on a sticker somewhere
the three arrows is a hate symbol
It is? That’s news to me. I’ve always though it was an anti-fascist symbol.
Edit: thanks all for the perspectives
Equating anything the Bolsheviks (or communists more broadly) ever did to the Nazis or monarchs requires such an extraordinary degree of bad faith false
dichotomyequivalence that you’re not worth my time even explaining why that’s borderline holocaust denialism. If you’re explicitly anticommunist you’re just another fascist to meThat’s a “false equivalence.” A “false dichotomy” is when you claim there are only two options when more exist.
Within the context of this image/historically, I agree. I don’t believe I’ve ever seen/discussed the three arrows as an anti-communist symbol today though. In the contexts that it’s used today, I certainly wouldn’t consider it a hate symbol.
I don’t believe I’ve ever seen/discussed the three arrows as an anti-communist symbol today though.
Honestly I agree with you there, but I can’t help but get (fairly) imo irked when I see someone, in need of an antifascist symbol, reaching for the explicitly anticommunist one as… and eyebrow raiser to say the least. Especially considering there are a lot of other ones that just… aren’t explicitly anticommunist? Why go for the 3 arrows when you can just go for a
instead?Yea I like the flags too. I’ve got a Zippo with those on it.
I’ve definitely seen libs use it according to its original meaning online, along with lots of other “both sides” memes.
The context I’ve seen it in today, I still would not trust anyone who uses it as they are, at best, an extremely naive radlib who moves in fed-adjacent circles (if they move at all, this symbol is very popular among do-nothing chomskyite office worker radlibs to put on their car. Not so commonly seen on the street amongst the actual antifa movement).
It’s a succdem symbol, but the succdem also got owned during fascist occupation so it became somewhat of an antifascist symbol
succdems are the moderate wing of fascism
the succs opened up the path to fascism and the german succs are basically 100% responsible for the Nazi takeover
Any time I’ve seen a Bluesky three arrows pfp - their bio always has shit like “Moderate. Realist. No far right. No far left…” It might as well read “I am a big dipshit horseshoe theorist.” And for some other people at Bluesky being anti-communist via euphemism is perfectly acceptable.
That’s just their way of saying “I am politically illiterate and know nothing about anything, and my entire historical knowledge comes from reddit memes”
I haven’t commented in any political Reddit sub since 2024. And I’ve only been there for politics in in very brief passing for the past couple years. Now that Trump is going to spend at least $40 billion just on concentration camps to literally warehouse human beings - I wonder what the new lib “How we gonna pay for it?” verbal meme is.
Ninja edit. I just realized that even though I was joking - libs only need one verbal meme for anything we want. It’s the thought-terminated cliché “We have to stop Trump.”
I can’t say that I’m overly familiar with the Bluesky Three Arrows crowd, but bsky is generally just Lib central.
Lib central
Bluesky was fun before the 2016 election. It had a “back to brunch” vibe and I could eavesdrop. But then the site became mostly lame. And now it’s (very) tedious on top of that. An example - people are arguing about the 2028 presidential race and Newsom in particular. But not a way that’s insightful, amusing or c/slop-worthy. Plus there are “Why do people keep talking about 2028 presidential race and Newsom in particular?” meta-posts.
being anti-communist via euphemism is perfectly acceptable.
I realized I wasn’t clear so I edited my post. Somebody simply saying “I’m anti-communist” is so uncouth. It just won’t do.
It was the symbol of the Iron Front, who effectively never fought and just existed on paper to threaten the Red Front and later Antifa. it was a symbol of reactionaries who would only even consider taking up arms against Communists, but couldn’t even do that and instead relied on their Green Police
it’s a “communism and fascism are equally bad, support the Rosa Killers” symbol
You’re joking, right? The poster literally says “against Hitler and Thälmann”, equating communists to fascists as if they hadn’t literally saved Europe (including Germany itself) from Nazism.
No it is a fascist symbol by being anti-communist.
The three arrows is the “do you condemn Hamas?” of 1930s Germany. A triangulated performative liberalism that opposes liberation and those actually fighting fascists.
Should we use anti-communist symbols of the freikorps rosa-killers? I’m gonna go out on a limb and say no
Of course not, it’s a sign of political illiteracy or anti-communism (most likely both).
I like to use this one (hence it being my profile banner), for image description please see my profile.
As everyone else has said, no, we should not. But with that out of the way, I’m surprised the anti-tankie crowd hasn’t adopted it to a much greater degree than the occasional reference. Like some of the other lemmy instances that make being “against tankies” their entire identity I would have thought would love to spam that symbol. Maybe I shouldn’t be giving them ideas if they happen to see this thread.
My first encounter with “3 arrows down” and what it meant was that early (c.2018) breadtuber who used it as his name, or his channel name anyway. I think he turned out to be a piece of shit by almost anyone’s standards (I forget what it was, but wasn’t there some scandal that ended his breadtube career?), and I wonder how much that poisoned the well for other anti-tankie “leftists” to want to use it. May have had nothing to do with it, but if so, highly critical support.
some scandal that ended his breadtube career
(I assume.)
It would be kind of funny to use it and replace the communist symbol with NATO.
The USSR no longer exists so there is an open spot.
Like some of the other lemmy instances that make being “against tankies” their entire identity I would have thought would love to spam that symbol.
They don’t use it because it’s a lib talking point that the SPD were willing to form a united front but the dogmatic Stalinist authoritarian KPD refused to play along which cause the Nazis to consolidate power. They then segue this to how you should not repeat history by voting for some neoliberal ghoul.
Don’t repeat history! Vote for Hindenburg!
I’m surprised the anti-tankie crowd hasn’t adopted it to a much greater degree than the occasional reference.
While the Liberals are largely ignorant about history, I think categorizing the Soviet Union and Nazi Germany as the same thing is a bridge too far even for them. This is why they focus on abstract critiques like “authoritarianism” or “totalitarianism.” These allow you to discard any alternative to the status quo without having to argue that the people who liberated Auschwitz are exactly the same as the people who built it.
edit before I read purpleworm’s reply:
Most of the time when Liberals are shitting on Communism and making grossly ahistorical claims (e.g. calling Putin or Trump a Communist), they are operating in the realm of rhetoric. The history is immaterial to them. They know from decades of programming that Communist is a cheap insult and they’ll use it whenever a strained analogy presents itself.
The type of disillusioned Liberal who is actually searching for the point where the United States strayed from the path righteousness, the type of Liberal who would use a symbol like this to differentiate themselves from the standard bearers of American decay, is not operating on this level of slop rhetoric.
tbf a lot of people do still say exactly that, equivocating between Soviet antisemitism and Nazi antisemitism and accusing the Soviets of just continuing to run the camps and so on.
I haven’t see them be asked what they meant by the latter and they don’t exactly cite sources, but I think they’re referring to the camps continuing to be used as temporary housing for the inmates during the end of the war and in its immediate aftermath, which is a pretty heinous way to mislead people.
I think they mean that arrested Nazis were at first put into their own camps.
No, the reactionaries that I’m talking about were definitely talking about Jews (etc.)
Three Arrows is apparently still going (just uploads very infrequently). idr any scandal but I never followed him very closely. He just seemed like a generic lib historian, honestly.
He’s a German Historian who has done videos specifically on WW1 propaganda. Think we found the problem.
The 3 arrows YouTuber rebranded as “the iron dice” once he learned what the 3 arrows actually represent.
Only if that’s German for ‘pick one, shoot two’
The 3 arrows are Marry, Fuck, Kill.
I’ll marry communism, kill fascism, and fuck the monarchy (I actually don’t even know what that third thing is)
Mustache ride from the Kaiser!
There are three dragons, one only lies, one only tells the truth, and one is royalty.
↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → B A select start
…is what i’d propose for an alternative. 99 lives for the anti fascist movement
This rips, someone with artistic skills should render the in the style of the three arrows, as a bit
Nah
